I'm also speaking from a health perspective. There are tons of studies debating the pros vs cons of *moderate* caffeine and alcohol consumption. Yes illicit drugs are 'bad', but probably not for the reasons you think...
Pyper America
- Thread starter sabine
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Can you expand on this?
Once in a blue moon I'll have the thought of 'fuck it I'm never taking anything again, let's live a clean life' then miserably fail when temptation shows its face 
Can Mormons smoke weed?
Probably because life in jail is way worse than doing a couple bumps of cocaine
Can you expand on this?
Probably because life in jail is way worse than doing a couple bumps of cocaine
oh I've thought of more things! The drugs your doing may not be the drugs that you think your doing (heroin is often subbed for ecstasy in Baltimore, sometimes coke is cut with meth or bleach or something else). If you take drugs, you may be afraid of telling the EMT's so you die when you don't tell them. Speaking of which, kids, always tell your doctor what youre taking; they still can't legally prosecute you or turn you over to the police unless you've committed another crime. The other day I watched a guy get shot and then demand the nurses give him his blunt back (and I'm not in a place where it's legal)- he still hadn't been arrested when I left.
Oh and making dumb decisions. Don't make decisions when you're high.
I mean, technically, yeah they can smoke weed. It's against the 'Word of Wisdom,' however. If you break the word of wisdom, it typically means you just can't go into the temples. It's seen as an equal to alcohol.
Cocaines a hard drug just by itself...why are we minimising its effects here? Apart from the well documented physically deleterious effects of the substance and the havoc the resulting dependence and addiction has...it's a societal burden in many ways. Although, it being 'bad' because sin etc...nope doesn't compute.
I didn't mention this because ZeroDiet mentioned bad effects from things you wouldn't guess. I feel like addiction is pretty well documented. Definitely agree that drugs are generally bad. Also, you're going to have to convince me that jail isn't worse than a couple of bumps. I'm not talking about addiction- I'm talking about a casual user, like every couple of months or something. Yea obviously that could lead to addiction, but thats probably more dependent on the person (their environment, genetics, reasons for using in the first place) using than the drug.
Also, let me say now, what I said was just guessing at what she meant. I could be totally off base here.
Eh. I know it's possible to not be 'addicted' and be a functional user or even a functional addict, but it's a slippery slope.
More people are prone to abuse than being that immune exception that just did that occasional bump. Especially if you think about the fact, that if you have access to social settings or groups where it's commonplace, the person might be doing more than just a 'bump' every now and then as they see it, especially if their barometer of measure are other folks who are using much much more in comparison. It can be quite self-deceiving, eg "I only use once a week and on the weekends" etc.
Also, sadly, I think a lot of people get addicted once in prison itself, jail can be notorious for that and I agree, prison life is a lot worse. No disagreement there.
I assume ZeroDiet meant the sin/damnation aspect and perhaps just the occasional hit too? But not sure either now.
Drugs may be fun to some people but they're never good for you (with the exception of medically prescribed, and even then it still may not be "good"). Also alcohol too, but some studies do show a glass of red wine can be beneficial.
Can you expand on this?
Think about the supply chain. Exploitation, torture, horrific murders, drug mules, extermination of forests and natural habitats to grow drug crops, extortion, funding terrorism, depleting the basic economy of impoverished local communities... the production of drugs is destroying people where they're made as well as potentially the lives of the end users. This is the main reason why I don't take drugs any more. I wasn't capable of saying no for health or legal reasons, but I can't support an industry where people lose their life so that I can get a buzz. Drugs are definitely morally bad for you even though they're a good experience to have.
I think also part of the fun is that it IS "bad." It can often be rare/momentous and appealing because it's taboo. Like sex in public. Like treating ourselves to cake (NOT that that's "taboo" but you get the point). It's also fun because of the social aspect and feeling the exclusivity it often entails (e.g. secret trips to the bathroom, having a secret, hiding it etc).
J
jules
Guest
A lot of violence and corruption surrounding the drug trade is because of its criminalisation, though. I'm not saying we should legalise heroin or anything but some countries which did so with weed and cocaine have seen less violence.
Oops didn't mean to be as elusive about this as I was. I'm always surprised about this but a lot of users have no clue what the fuck they're taking. Then again, they don't care. It could be laced with bleach and they'd still inject it into their veins, but then again, addicts... I've actually had a patient tell me his dealer INSISTED he was selling X after I warned him (the patient) absolutely not to touch the 'new' stuff because it was Y and very very dangerous in terms of overdose risk. Sorry can't be more specific as it would possibly give my location away. (My patients tell me everything in case you're wondering...not sure why)I assume ZeroDiet meant the sin/damnation aspect and perhaps just the occasional hit too? But not sure either now.
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From my experience, most people get CLEAN when they go to jail. They look much much better after they've been in jail for a while, off the hard stuff, and stabilized on psych meds. Unfortunately this doesn't tend to last once they're released...
I never minimized the effects of drugs nor said they were 'good/health neutral' (was very careful with my wording in my prev posts); just stating that alcohol and caffeine aren't necessarily unhealthy. Nothing is black and white and it's absolute ridiculous imo to live in absolutes like that. As for hard drugs, I agree there's a high societal burden***, but I'm not one to judge the occasional social user re "health" just like I'm not in a place to judge a poorly managed pt on their lack of health. You only live once, and people have different priorities, so... there's that.
***I should also add there's a huge market for buying/selling presciption drugs; it's not just a problem with the hard stuff you typically think about
Oh yep. I get you.
I never condone drugs but when it comes to patients, it doesn't colour my opinions one bit if that makes sense.
About drugs in jail, in the US atleast, the statistics admit to quite a bit of substance abuse problem in state prisons. It's better in other countries though.
They're getting very strict with prescription abuse in the states too, I think a physician got hard time last year for the first time.